World: r3wp

indeed, thx GrahamC

$ nc time-a.nist.gov 13

55676 11-04-25 16:30:36 50 0 0 433.9 UTC(NIST) *

Robert, you could do your presentation along the lines of my Boron 
presentation?

Good idea, do you have a link?

http://tryrebol.esperconsultancy.nl/Boron/

Show them HELP (?) and SOURCE, which are strong tools to get you 
going as a programmer.

As for R3 console, which is ugly, but has some helpfull features 
too:

 Chat - open DevBase developer forum/BBS
 Docs - open DocBase document wiki (web)
 Bugs - open CureCode bug database (web)
 Demo - run demo launcher (from rebol.com)
 Help - show built-in help information
 Upgrade - check for newer releases
 Changes - what's new about this version (web)

And how to build sentences from words and values without irritating 
syntax to get in the way.

The benefit from having so many datatypes, which make functions work 
in many ways depending on argument datatype. One good example, I 
think, is READ, but you can probably find others.

e.g. I always welcome the ability to check the changelog - nice addition 
with Changes.

Also:

>> 1 / 0
** Math error: attempt to divide by zero
** Where: /
** Near: / 0

>> why?
Opening web browser...

Is it really a good idea to go deep into R3, with the situation?

probably not, but why not outline the planned future? R3 is alpha, 
and it should be treated as such. R3 adds nice stuff - unicode, modules, 
control of boot sequence, devices, codecs, etc. Robert might face 
the questions of recent REBOL status anyway ....

is there any future? Maybe postapocalyptic world where the only way 
how to comunicate is face to face or using ham radios.

REBOL has fostered ideas in many people, and I'm sure, whose ideas 
will evolve into a future with better programming tools, than the 
world has today. So yes, I'll say there is a future.

I only have 6:40 mintues. So, I concentrate on REBOL as a language, 
not so much on R3 / R2 the products.

Devices, codecs? Where?

They are there, just not finished and optimal ...

Where?

There are just some traces of them as an internal implementation 
detail. There's nothing you can do with them

There are reasons that you don't see anybody writing extra devices 
and codecs

Kaj - I think  that you are not accurate, and that you even know 
it?. Codecs are useless, and even Carl later introduced the plan,of 
how to reimplement them. But devices? There is list of devices out 
there, no? http://www.rebol.net/wiki/DevicesThe other fact is, that 
those are not usable via extensions, but it does not mean the abstraction 
is not there?

Yes, they're there, as an implementation detail of the internal abstraction 
of R3. The only place where some devices are exported is in the host 
kit, but they're hardwired there. You can port those specific devices 
to other platforms, but other than that, there's nothing you can 
do with the abstraction

Robert, code, including gui's,  created by other code and then executed, 
is a great feature of Rebol.

Robert: here is a proposition for presenting View + VID + REBOL coding:


1) Show this code on a slide, explain briefly what it does and run 
it: 
REBOL []

view layout [
	code: area 300x200
	btn "Run" [view/new layout load code/text]
]


2) Enter some VID code in the textarea, click Run and listen to the 
"wow" in the audience ;-)

You can type, for example:

across
text "Name:" f: field
btn "Say" [alert join "Hello " f/text]

BTW, you might want to patch the 'button VID style to point to 'btn 
for this demo. "button" would be much better for the code demo, but 
the look of "btn" is way nicer (and more modern).

also, go to nick's page to get VERY cool 5-10 line scripts which 
are impressive.

Thx for the input, I'm going to see how to put all aspects into it.

but one thing you need to highlight, is that for all of your needs 
(code, style, layout, server, client, templates, controls, localization, 
etc) you are using a single highly natural language.    This is the 
power of Dialects, (DSL). 


datatypes are also a great differentiator of REBOL... just run code 
and leave an HTML tag in the code, as-is... that is cool.  most languages 
require literal data to be assigned, but in rebol data IS an expression 
so as long as there are no syntax issues, you can just embed data 
within the code (for whatever reason you need it in source managing 
tools).

I have Dialects using VID and Doc's example to show: data is code, 
code is data.

Datatypes is good.

show that you also use the same language for creating style sheets, 
new controls, sending a VID layout over tcp, etc.  just showing how 
small the code snippets are is enough I guess.


Make a little parallel between the web nonsense, and the simplicity 
of doing the same thing in rebol. (5-7 different languages, vs one)

cause even though people think other languages are simple, they still 
have to deal with using several completely incompatible languages.

(in today's "accepted" programming model)

How many standard words does R3 have?

Is it: length? system/contexts/lib

I'd count the alphabetical listing of words in the dictionnary on 
the web.

>> length? unique compose [(words-of system/contexts/lib) (words-of 
system/contexts/sys)]
== 633

well, ignore sys

what's usable from sys is imported into lib anyways

>> length? words-of system/contexts/lib
== 609

(which, for contexts, should be the same as length? system/contexts/lib 
anyway, but i'm sure brian will chime in on this issue later)

Ok, thanks.

I think I will save the last 40s to even include a Q&A section into 
my pecha kucha :-) because  Rebol is just that compact and simple, 
that I don't need 20 slides ;-)

;-)

It's length? system/words/lib right in a fresh console, otherwise 
there might be new words added.

>> length? lib
== 609

That too, since 'lib and 'sys are predefined in the lib and sys contexts 
for convenience.

Wow, there are three languages less popular
 [than REBOL, on Github].


I wouldn't worry about those stats too much at the moment. It seems 
that projects are re-indexed when there is commit activity within 
the project. So some REBOL projects on Github are not yet correctly 
classified and counted.


On the other hand, the same probably holds true for other recently 
added languages.

so you mean,  we should strive to be the last in the list?   ;-)

IMO C is coming back. Simple, matured, works.

hmm

It probably comes back, but I find it too easy to make mistakes in.
Pro is also, it's fast at execution.
Good libraries might help with the mistakes.

Than D2 is a good choice