World: r3wp
[Parse] Discussion of PARSE dialect
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BrianH 28-Jun-2006 [1040] | For that matter, what about words in quotes? |
Graham 28-Jun-2006 [1041] | only if capitalised |
BrianH 28-Jun-2006 [1042] | So, no difference. |
Graham 28-Jun-2006 [1043x6] | I'll explain the purpose of all this. |
A person is writing a text file. It has headings which are denoted by caps, and terminating in ":". | |
But some headings are two or more words ... with the last terminating in ":" only. | |
Words inside the text, even in caps should not normally be highlighted. | |
that's the more complete spec. | |
Anyway, i have a working version now :) | |
BrianH 28-Jun-2006 [1049] | Well, I hope I helped :) |
Graham 28-Jun-2006 [1050] | Yep .. thanks all. |
Tomc 28-Jun-2006 [1051] | replace/all "</strong> <strong>" "" |
[unknown: 9] 28-Jun-2006 [1052] | What is the best description of Parse? I would like to point some people to Parse as an example of the power of Rebol |
Henrik 28-Jun-2006 [1053] | reichart, I wrote one in the wikibook, don't know if it's useful. |
[unknown: 9] 28-Jun-2006 [1054] | Since you wrote one, do you know of a better one? This is not a reflection on yours, but it is a great way to know what you considered the next best thing. |
Tomc 28-Jun-2006 [1055x2] | salvation from regular expressions |
I may have added some the the rebol wikibook | |
BrianH 29-Jun-2006 [1057x3] | To use the simpler of the CS terms: Parse is a rule-based, recursive-descent string and structure parser with backtracking. It is not a parser generator (like Lex/Yacc) or compiler (like most regex engines) - the engine follows the rules directly. Since Parse is recursive-descent it can handle patterns that regular expressions wouldn't be able to. Since Parse backtracks it can handle patterns that ordinary recursive-descent parsers can't. Basically, it puts the text and structure processing abilities of Perl 5 to shame, let alone those of the lesser regex engines. In theory, Perl 6 has caught up with REBOL, but Perl 6 only exists in theory for now. By the time it becomes actual REBOL should surpass it (especially if I have anything to say about it). |
It's pretty easy to demonstrate patterns that regular expressions can't handle. It's only somewhat difficult to demonstrate patterns that can't be handled by a recursive descent parser without backtracking or unlimited lookahead. I have never run into a pattern that can't be handled by Parse in theory - its only limits are in implementation (available memory and recursion depth). I am not qualified to describe its limits. Still, you have to be careful about how you write the rules or they will trip you up. | |
A little dry as explanations go, I suppose. You may get better luck by showing some magic parse code tricks :) | |
Volker 29-Jun-2006 [1060] | Somewhat buzzy: Its a simplified compiler-compiler. Could be used to build a java-compiler (eg such complex syntax), but its also as easy as regex for simpler things. But still readable. (less buzzy: not always that easy due to the poorer lockahead). |
BrianH 29-Jun-2006 [1061] | Volker, it's more like it can do what a compiler-compiler can do without needing to compile :) And backtracking is about the same as unlimited lookahead, but more powerful. |
[unknown: 9] 29-Jun-2006 [1062] | Thanks Brian, but as is the theme with questions I ask, I don't ask for myself, but rather that the "world" can learn what "we" know. So perhaps you should add your 2 cents to Henriks, and Tom's in a public forum of the Wikibook. |
Volker 29-Jun-2006 [1063] | the compiling is no big argument as compiler-compilers are for compiled languages anyway ;) the point is, you can mix a grammar and actions for semantics easy. |
BrianH 29-Jun-2006 [1064] | Reichart, I figured as much (hence the "dry" comment). I'll look over the Wikibook and see if I can help. |
Volker 29-Jun-2006 [1065] | Your points are ok,only wanted to try somewhat shorter |
BrianH 29-Jun-2006 [1066] | Volker, it still might be a good point that you can skip a step with parse, depending on the listener. Parse is more of a compiler-interpreter really. The real point I was making was about the lookahead. |
Volker 29-Jun-2006 [1067] | I can plug in handcrafted parsers with some cocos too. |
JaimeVargas 29-Jun-2006 [1068] | I agree brian parrse allows you to write interpreter easily. Regarding compilation I guess it does that too. But the problem is more difficult. |
Volker 29-Jun-2006 [1069] | aah. a compiler-compiler produces sourcecode to be compiled, but you can interpret data with it. |
BrianH 29-Jun-2006 [1070] | Most compiler-compilers have fixed lookahead. Bactracking is equivalent to unlimited lookahead. |
Volker 29-Jun-2006 [1071] | i guess that depends on the coco. the point is, a bnf by default, and code inside therules, instead of putting things in vars andprocess later. IMHO. |
BrianH 29-Jun-2006 [1072x2] | Jaimie, I meant that parse is itself an interpreter, not a compiler. It interprets compiler specs (or interpreter specs, etc.). |
Volker, I've used a lot of compiler-compilers before and reviewed many more, and unlimited lookup or backtracking are rare. | |
JaimeVargas 29-Jun-2006 [1074] | Brian, In this you are right, is an parse is an interpreter that allows easy construction of other interpreter, which the emphasis on DSLs. |
Volker 29-Jun-2006 [1075] | then the advantages of parse are beeing like a compiler-compiler and habving unlimited lookup etc? |
BrianH 29-Jun-2006 [1076x3] | Yup :) |
I'm not sure whether not having a seperate tokenizer is a plus or a minus, though. | |
I guess you could think of block parsing as using load as a tokenizer. | |
Volker 29-Jun-2006 [1079x2] | IMHO that would add overhead for the simple things. |
and you can use parse to tokenize first? | |
BrianH 29-Jun-2006 [1081] | Two rounds of parsing, one for tokenizing and one to parse? Interesting. That would work if you don't have control over the source syntax - otherwise load works pretty well for simple languages. |
Volker 29-Jun-2006 [1082] | Thats where i got the idea: tokenize first and use block-parser :) |
BrianH 29-Jun-2006 [1083] | I've been using that approach for XML processing. |
Volker 29-Jun-2006 [1084] | sounds good. if one finds a good tokenized representation. I am not an xml-guru :( |
BrianH 29-Jun-2006 [1085x2] | My next personal project is to go through the XML/XSL/REST specs and create exactly that. I already have an efficient structure, I just need to fill out the semantics to support the complete logical model of XML. |
I am also not an XML guru, but I will be by the time I'm done :) | |
Volker 29-Jun-2006 [1087] | After i read " go through the XML/XSL/REST specs" ithought soo. Beeing undecised ifiprefer to run away or participate curiously. |
BrianH 29-Jun-2006 [1088x2] | Well, I know enough to know where to look to figure out the rest. |
Still, "run away" is a common and sensible reaction to XML. | |
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