World: r3wp

ok, what you miss in particular when you compare with creating such 
ui with rebol? You can start with placing images at concrete (absolute) 
position, not using auto-positioning mechanism too .... in opposite, 
ajax design means combination of js, html, css .... just asking

isn't it because you are a web guy? You know how to do design, you 
have visual editor etc. What would be needed for you to turn it into 
comparatively looking rebol equivalent?

I have my feet firmly in both camps.  I look for crossover, and look 
and feel is one part that is more consistent on the web.

but then you are not talking fully rich apps? Are you? Grid, tabs, 
combo-boxes, list-boxes, group-boxes, etc.

Also, while JS is inelegant compared with Rebol, it is not the millstone 
you make it out to be...

I am not sure I am the one who tries to pretend js is ugly or so 
;-) In fact, I start to like C-like/basic-like apps, and I am not 
sure I would learn functional language once again ....

Ajax is a clear combination of four components protocol (http), data/interface 
(html), presentation (css) and behaviour (js).  You can create a 
functional web app with the first two.  Then you can optimise by 
modifying behaviour.  Then (or from the beginning) make it look good 
with CSS.

what bothers me, for simple apps is, that for typical "developer" 
as me, I have to utilise html, css, javascript, visual tools ... 
and that is too much on me ...

What is the value of 'fully rich apps', at least for the sake of 
it?  If 'rich' allows for better expression of the problem at hand, 
then that's good.  However, there is a tendency to allow 'rich' to 
define the problem, that's bad.

Ashely, in addition to your list of a b c items, I would say simplicity 
is actually #1.  While immediacy is very important, people seem to 
really want and understand single word descriptions, that go no further.....Weather, 
Stock, Tasks, Music, etc.   Almost no prefs, and almost no buttons...

Sorry, and just realized, we should all move this convo out of here 
and into one of the UI groups...which one?  I would like to address 
Pekr and Chris on this CSS/Reblet issue, I think you will like my 
direction...

web?

or we can establish new group .... this is interesting topic .... 
I would like to get everybody's idea, as VID will be redone for 3.0 
.... maybe we could move more towards css aproach and the like ....?

Exactly my thought as well.

Let me look through the massive list.

Hmmm, I don't see anything that exactly nails this topic.  Clearly 
this about UI, VID, widgets, ease of developement.   Perhaps...

Some names
VID - This perhaps is the most direct.
UI - This works too, and perhaps it is "UI - VID, Others"

I will make it, and we can always rename.

or VID+

Done.

ah, strange issue .... I swear I saw your post being longer, then 
group became red once again, it seems like edited down :-)

Yes.  I posted the complete contents of my edit buffer (Word), and 
deleted it and restarted.  Not that anything was important, but it 
may have read oddly (even for my posts).

Btw, before leaving this group, Firebug (for Firefox) goes a long 
way to making JS more transparent...

Agreed.

I wonder if plug-in could be used as partial replacement for javascript?

I mean - integrated in similar way, for usage purposes, not to replace 
it ....

NetKernel OS - anyone heard of this one? http://www.1060.org/

JAVA 6 to support scripting, speed-up client side GUI, etc - http://www.betanews.com/article/Sun_Releases_Second_Java_6_Beta/1150922228

some of JAVA 6 features - http://java.sun.com/javase/6/webnotes/features.html

Level of scripting support in JAVA 6 - http://jcp.org/en/jsr/detail?id=223

http://www.byoms.com(but keep tracking www.kozoru.com)

java. hated by end-users so much it's had to retreat from desktops 
& browsers to hide on the server. :-)

and it can stay there.

The battle is shifting beyond Windows and Linux," he says. "Google 
isn't concerned about what executes down on the client machine, whether 
it's Windows or Linux. The action has moved up a level. The real 
innovation in software is not occurring in the context of the 1980s 
and 1990s PC. It's occurring in applications that reside in the broader 
Web. The interesting innovations are going to occur around different 
ways to organize and share and access information."" -- Paul Maritz 
(once 3rd in comand at Microsoft) regarding his new venture.. PI 
 http://www.forbes.com/technology/2006/06/23/linux_vista_open_cz_dl_0623linux.html

The rise and fall of CORBA. Quite interesting: http://www.acmqueue.com/modules.php?name=Content&pa=showpage&pid=396

http://toute.ca/- a system REBOL was born to have (forget the 
continuations, think about the message passing).

doable in R3?

I was thinking along the lines of a dialect in R2.

If I reuse the Rugby I/O engine..... I think if we use a few conventions 
for leightwight processes migration might be possible as well...

with triple transport: http, tcp, UDP

go for it!

doesn't erlang allow for distributed cpu processing as well on nodes

would be nice to take advantage of dual core processors

what is it about and what the benefits would be?

fault tolerance

We saw attempts for some concepts, like Chord, which already failed 
due to unstable low-level networking code ....

error propagation

messaging system? OK, I will better investiigate the link ....

distributed virus networks

where does it fit with Uniserve, Rugby, Rebservices, Beer? Is it 
an upper layer, transport independent?