World: r3wp

organised??

coordinate team work

I guess any team work projects have not registered in my consciousness

Unity3D is a mixed license product too. Developers pay for the closed-source 
portions.

It's one of the only open source business plans that works nowadays. 
Pure open source usually generates no income for the creators and 
contributors of a project.

To be fair, with Unity3D the core is open and the outer layers are 
closed. Perhaps REBOL is getting it backwards.

BrianH, there are software companies that provide fully open sourced 
solutions while charging only for training/support, and this business 
model seems to work well. See:
http://www.appcelerator.com
http://www.sencha.com(ExtJs creators)

Agreed, you have to look at the community as a whole, not just a 
single company. In those cases, the closed outer layer is written 
by other companies and the inner core programmers are supported through 
patronage (training/support models are variants on patronage). Most 
open source code is supported either by patronage, by selling closed 
addons, or is just a hobby/charity.

And even charities have to be supported through patronage if they 
want to get large-scale work done.

RMA's GUI is an open core supported by closed apps written on it, 
which is where it's funding comes from. They make money from the 
closed portions, not the open parts.

For that matter, even closed source freeware follows the same model: 
Charity, freemium or donation/support/training.

Guys, products are not going to be developed by keeping on talking 
about them. You have to sit down and do them

As Cyphre says, it all depends on your abilities. So I can understand 
that many people still feel powerless in the R3 situation, but that's 
the wrong way to approach it. You have to determine what you can 
do already and just do it

been there, done that, and no satisfaction

No products, then

STEEVE +100 but STEEVE clearly RMA don't want to work with us they 
want to start their business  using us as publicity and free testing 
ground ... you can't mixe free and not free that way ... If you do 
a foundation that gather  donations and reparts those donations to 
the main "contributors" according to their contribution then it's 
a totally different situation than what is made actually. First the 
source code produced and paid by the foundation belongs to the foundation. 
They don't belong to an obscure commercial entity ( I'm sure Robert 
cyphre and the other has the best volunty in the world and only good 
intention but the way it's done only  make me believe they want to 
use us to get money on our back one way or another)

but steeve thing is ALL pass by Carl so one way or another if you 
want your work to be merged to the official distribution and shared 
then you have to comply with the expectations of Carl  somehow and 
 have him merging your release to his and vise and versa ...

So R3/GUI will mix paid stuff through bounties made by RMA and free 
stuff made by  benevolant wanting to make the thing goes on

well I will stop here I already explained my point of view on this 
matter ... but yes we lack volunty we lack people we lack knowledge 
we lack time we lack direction etc...

If you think the current contributors want to make money over your 
back, why don't you simply make everything yourself? Problem solved

Kaj ok so your idea of a working rebol community is a rebol community 
with 10 R3/GUI because 10 of us has different ideas on the topic.

Kaj that's not my way to see that that's all but don't worry i'm 
looking for people to help me do my own project and discuss about 
a forked R3/GUI  you are free to join the discussion... And I won't 
ask you pennies for functionalities :).

but as usual it's shadwolf do your stuff in your corner and shut 
the fuck off  like it was for most of my work...

that's not communautary work... that's not the way a community should 
work you think the guys in blender, gtk+ the gimp etc... work without 
exchanging informations each on their corners and that's how their 
projects goes on? We are not alot so we need to be more focused than 
any other and creating distansions and oposing the gurus to the rest 
of the world isn't the right path. But as yuri said on another forum 
lesson 1 rebol is a bobbistic language, it's the hobby of Carl and 
the hobby of most of us and that's why when it sucks people disapears 
to do other things.

this community is dieing but maybe that's the goal persued you want 
everyone to flee this community to stay betwin gurus ...

Kaj what happend if the day of tomorow Carl says like he did 2 times 
already ok this project R3/GUI can't go on like that I will reform 
it ?

it's not only against some people in this community that i'm doing 
my asks that's to have a clear ground to know what we can do what 
we can't what quality we could expect will the bugs we submit will 
be solved ? will RMA group will goes on after the initial "release" 
? How will be  decided the the futur work on that topic .. See all 
that are topic that concerns us.

Think of what you could produce if you put all that energy you spend 
arguing into development

...RMA don't want to work with us...

 - that is a lie. RMA do want to work with all developers wanting 
 to cooperate. In fact, there are areas, where you could easily contribute. 
 But, if you instead try to show RMA do something you don't want them 
 to do, then your this is not how cooperation works.

Something to change the mood - Have a banana split Guys - (Vintage 
79's)
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XgVttp5pfjI

Speculation about the future new app model for development under 
Windows:


http://www.osnews.com/story/24233/Is_Microsoft_Working_Towards_NT_Silverlight_Net_Everywhere_

Sorry, I stopped reading once I read "According to Paul Thurrot" 
;)

I stopped reading when the referenced articles actually said that 
they had been proven wrong.

No problem, they got your ad impressions already...

Scala Team Wins ERC Grant: The Scala research group at EPFL is excited 
to announce that they have won a 5 year European Research Grant of 
over 2.3 million Euros to tackle the "Popular Parallel Programming" 
challenge. http://www.scala-lang.org/node/8579

PS3 Hacked Once and For All?
http://forum.digital-digest.com/showthread.php?t=94339

Sony sues Geohot and his team over PS3 3.55 jailbreak

http://www.geek.com/articles/games/sony-sues-geohot-and-his-team-over-ps3-3-55-jailbreak-20110112/


Does Sony have a case? Was it ok, when Sony removed the "install 
other OS" feature? Was it legal?

this is a very nice demo about security... Brian should go over this 
whole thing and I'm sure he'll get some ideas into increasing the 
security model in REBOL.

The question is, does Sony have a clue?

1 sec Linux cold boot to Qt environment for home automatition. That's 
how I imagined some minimal R3 based environment :-) 
http://www.embedded-bits.co.uk/2011/1-second-linux-boot-to-qt/

Pekr that's the kind of stuff i like to read ...

We've not applied any specific intellectual property but instead 
spent time analysing where boot delays are coming from and simply 
optimising them away. The majority of the modifications we make usually 
fall into the category of 'removing things that aren't required', 
'optimising things that are required', or 'taking a new approach 
to solving problems' and are tailored very precisely to the needs 
of the 'product'.

and in the end it's insanely fast booting ...

Here's graph, how they reduced execution times in particular sections 
- http://www.swiftboot.com/swiftBoot/Home.html

yeah but this is a very super specific 1 application run environement 
...

but even ... the fluidity of boot knowing it's only a 500Mhz processor 
is amazing ...

exactly - I am quite surprised, as Linux are not generally fast in 
boot times, and this is embedded area (Renesas chips).

I like extrem stuffs like that ... It shows that hardware progress 
just servs people to be more lazy in their creation. At a time hardware 
was short and expensive people were spending zillions hours to  optimise 
everything even going on the lower possible assembly level to have 
just and only the necessary. Now in days with  our gigantic powerfull 
processor people stoped to optimise things they pile up to the sky 
things and don't care if it take 30 more times to execute ...

Pekr linux is fast on boot time i mean a genuine  linux ubuntu 10.10 
on a 1.6 ghz procesor like my netbook boots up in 30 seconds wich 
isn't bad at all compare to the 5 minutes of boot time needed to 
 start windows 7 starter ed on same machine...

That's how computers should work in general. My new 2.53 GHz MacBook 
Pro with solid state drive boots in 17 seconds or so. My old iBook 
G4 boots in 50 seconds. Still my old 50 Mhz 68030 Amiga could boot 
in less than 10 seconds.

then you have chromeOS which boots in 8 secs on my machine or android 
they are linux ... but very specialised one they are closer in that 
aspect to  what does switchboot