World: r3wp
[!REBOL3-OLD1]
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BrianH 29-Sep-2009 [18434] | It's a really high priority. |
Pekr 29-Sep-2009 [18435] | What will it allow us to do? Any real-life example? |
BrianH 29-Sep-2009 [18436x3] | Asynchronous calls, callbacks, synchronizing with external code. Database access. |
SSL | |
OpenGL, etc. | |
Pekr 29-Sep-2009 [18439x2] | Why you need it for DB access for e.g.? Is it because you simply want async behaviour, and that is only possible via stand-alone device? So we will e.g. implement SQLite.device? |
re REMOVE 1 vs 2 - couldn't we have both? Simply either rule is following, or index? :-) Both seem to be usefull .... | |
BrianH 29-Sep-2009 [18441x2] | Yup. It will be required for synchronizing with multi-tasking R3. |
We really can't have REMOVE 1 and 2 both - the rules don't match, there would be ambiguity. | |
Pekr 29-Sep-2009 [18443x2] | What is the Device model though? We have not seen any examples yet. So you take extension API, create some SQLite.dll (extension), and integrate it via Devices API? |
Then let's have REMOVE 1, to make Steeve happy :-) He is right that index aproach still can work in terms of storing a position into variable and doing REBOL level remove in parens ... | |
BrianH 29-Sep-2009 [18445] | Look in the port model docs - they talk a lot about devices. The only thing added will be the ability to write your own. |
Pekr 29-Sep-2009 [18446] | Two new blog articles. Release notes updated too ... |
Henrik 29-Sep-2009 [18447] | Regarding the R3 web console: I'm bowing out as the back end seems much more complicated to do than I thought. There are also still security issues. I'll gladly hand the source to someone else, if they want to continue. |
shadwolf 29-Sep-2009 [18448x3] | BrianH and I work together well, but the two of us alone are not enough! .... It's about 10 years the rebol ommunity tells you can't do all alone and you need to open the source code... this doesn't means the final integration word is not yours... This doesn"t mean that you will have 100% ready to go additions. This doesn't mean that rebol VM will be stabilised to less than 1Mo ... More you have embeded feature hard written in the VM bigger it is that's why the "extension" approache is good. Then the VM can be seen a minimal execution environement able to run any ind of things ... that the way most of the "regular" script languages works. |
i like tht way to resume parse action car "Match then Action" then the problem is when you match somthing then you when your action not to impact on the match thing but on the following or preciding thing. The index system is the main problem in my opinion: where i am ? what does i store and until what point ? i'm before or after my match ? and if my match is not given in the right way how can i be sure my match tags are not taken inverted and that my action system will not freak out ? Programming in parse gives you so many "asks" to care about that you are fast lost. But i'm agree the result of parse rules in general once understoud (if it's any time the case ) is easy and beauty full. | |
and i think parse is already a big enhancement compared to regular expression ( i give a try to it past week writing a software in ruby ... that's horrible ... I mean i'm complaining about parse but regular expression is so much a bore and stupid to write + they don't allow any action they are just made for match only way to have regular expresion doing something is in ruby using them with an action mathod of the string class..... And that the kind of stupid things most of coders in the world today found fantastic ??? HOOOO really ???) So when we come from mystring.match( "/\d\w***.*" ) kind of things of course going to the match action parse way is complicated... but complicated maybe not the way it's supposed to be. Parse works better on "tags" words matching more than cabalistic formulas like regular exapressions. This doeasnt means it can't be doing that too.. | |
shadwolf 30-Sep-2009 [18451] | what i have real difficulties to figure out in parse is the index system... I have a problem to see where i'm and what my actions is doing. do i "store index match then action" or do i "match store then action" ? And if you add to that the sub rules i'm like completly lost. Cause in some cases sub rules can trigger their own particular special only for them actions ... |
Chris 30-Sep-2009 [18452] | Sorry to ask what I may be able to find elsewhere, but what is the current policy on multiplatform alpha releases? I've just tried a82 on OS X (my second foray into R3) but understand the new parse features are a83+. |
shadwolf 30-Sep-2009 [18453] | sems like things are done for windows first then adapted to other OSes... That's how i understand the realease method basing me on what i saw alreeady you have some realease that adds new things then releases that only add those new things to other than windows OSes... |
Chris 30-Sep-2009 [18454] | But how far behind might it be? |
PeterWood 30-Sep-2009 [18455x2] | In the past Carl seemed to skip building the "big" alpha releases for OSX and Linux until the Windows has been tested. I would guess that we'll see a84 or a 85 for OSX. |
The OSX version of Rebol3 is missing things that are in the Windows version (extensions) and has a number of bugs such as no internal event handling so that wait consumes 100% of the CPU, server ports don't work (probably related to no internal event handling) and call doesn't work properly. | |
Chris 30-Sep-2009 [18457] | 'k, will be patient. I've a small project set aside... |
PeterWood 30-Sep-2009 [18458] | R3 will run as a CGI under OSX though, it doesn't yet do so on Windows. |
shadwolf 30-Sep-2009 [18459x2] | about chat ... i always said it was hard to have a precise location of interresting exchanges ... but that's the same in altme... in fact any discussion here or in chat when it pops out interresting ideas should then be resume into a temporary task list but ... that's normal most of the time discussion here are mixed we don't only propose enhancements we try to figure out how things works then we try to give how things could or should be working in order to make our lifes easier... It's a difficult task to keep tracks on every good idea passed throught altme or Chat system... |
i don't understand the "it will work as cgi ..." does it means outside an apache server and through a html page rebol won't work ? then rebol would be something like a custom php ? | |
PeterWood 30-Sep-2009 [18461] | REBOL3 cgi scripts don't work on Windows (under Apache or IIS) but do run on OSX (under Apache). |
Graham 30-Sep-2009 [18462] | Are there any rebol based R3 web servers yet? |
BrianH 30-Sep-2009 [18463x2] | There's barely a client. Web server support was originally intended to be built in, but we'll see whether the work gets done. Openning the source doesn't magically provide more people to do the work. We need help. |
Shadwolf, most of the code in R3 is open already. | |
Sunanda 30-Sep-2009 [18465] | Why does this take over a minute to complete? dt [ parse [1] [some []] ] (There is a similar time issue with R2) |
Henrik 30-Sep-2009 [18466x2] | I thought that was fixed... |
it's the same with an empty ANY rule. | |
BrianH 30-Sep-2009 [18468] | A SOME or ANY rule that does not advance is an endless loop. [some []] is equivalent to [some [none]]. |
Henrik 30-Sep-2009 [18469x2] | can this not be fixed? I can't see why one would want such a rule. |
and I imagine a lot of beginners getting stuck in this. | |
Sunanda 30-Sep-2009 [18471] | Endless I can understand....but 90 seconds run time is something else :) Perhaps Secure will handle it one day. |
Steeve 30-Sep-2009 [18472] | well, we can't either protect again someone coding >> forever [] |
BrianH 30-Sep-2009 [18473] | This is on purpose (the "fix" was reverted). Sometimes, particularly when your loop contains modifiers or productions you don't want it to advance. |
Steeve 30-Sep-2009 [18474] | they do the mistake, one time, two times, but no 3 times. |
BrianH 30-Sep-2009 [18475] | It's a documentation problem, not a dialect problem. Parsing is only a beginner task to a limited extent. |
Henrik 30-Sep-2009 [18476x2] | I disagree on unfixing this. It's hostile towards the beginner to allow hanging the parser and I ran into this quite a few times, before finding out what went wrong. |
and I still occasionally accidentally activate it when building parsers in the console. | |
BrianH 30-Sep-2009 [18478x2] | Parsing is not a beginner task. There are many ways you can shoot yourself in the foot with PARSE, and we just added more. Live with the fact that some concepts require some explanation :) |
This is why we have the ?? operation and TRACE function. | |
Henrik 30-Sep-2009 [18480] | can you show me an example where SOME [] is useful? |
BrianH 30-Sep-2009 [18481] | some [remove "a"] |
Steeve 30-Sep-2009 [18482] | not some [], but empty rules |
Maxim 30-Sep-2009 [18483] | oh, I find the new stuff makes much of the engine much less exponentially guru level. its like... in R2, parsing a number in a string is easy... extracting a chain of them requires some thought, beyond that... people bleed from their eyes ;-) |
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