World: r3wp

Actually, you bring up a good point. There is currently no reason 
to know what keys are currently defined in a map because in theory 
all possible keys are defined in a map - they just don't have values 
yet. If you try to retrieve the value for a key that is not in the 
map yet, you get #[none] (the value, not the word). If you want to 
not have a key in the map, just set its value to #[none]. Yeah, that 
key may be physically still in the map, but who cares? The effect 
is the same - the only difference is memory usage.

If it matters to you whether a key is in the map or not (regardless 
of its value), you should probably be using object! instead. With 
object! there is actually a difference between the key being there 
or not, and you can always expand an object with new fields if you 
need to in R3.

Anyone that is not a fan of the Win console.  Try Cygwin and install 
rxvt.   (No need for the X11, rxvt runs beautifully as a windows 
app).  It's not as featured as the REBOL 2 console, but it's a step 
up (and a little sideways) from the dos console.

If that works, tell me. I haven't been having any luck in using alternate 
consoles with the R3 alpha - the stdio device is broken.

Anyone else think it's kind of freaky when we have 3 Brian's messaging 
in the same group at the same time? ;)

It's just multiple views of the greater Brian ideal :)

:)

Pan-Brianism :)

I was thinking about the difference between a map and a normal object. 
It's easy to slip into a Perl/Python sort of mindset, where maps 
are often the most convenient way to describe data. It can be easy 
to forget the flexibility of Rebol datatypes.

If you don't like the way a datatype works, try another. At least 
we're not going the Perl route and adding operators. :)

thank goodness for that. I'm enjoying perl 6, but man oh man I get 
lost in the syntax sometimes.

The behavior of map! is part of a general change in R3 to make the 
none value be a placeholder for missing data, like null in SQL. Even 
the series accessors (first, second, ...) now return none when accessing 
indexes off the end - this means that you can now thing of the current 
length of a series as an relatively unimportant detail that you can 
ignore in some circumstances.

thing -> think

rxvt quick tests;  stdio is not reliable (with the defaults - these 
are quick tests)  

$ ./rebhost.exe -q   >> call "ls"    works    >> call "less readme.html" 
  does not detect console.
$./rebhost.exe < small.r  does not work

so in short, not a good choice for redirection, but seems ok for 
the testing I've been doing.  Haven't tried running gnu readline 
with it yet to see if command line recall will work.  I've gotten 
too used to editing source and do'ing.

$ rlwrap rebhost.exe   gives nice command line recall within R3 under 
the rxvt console.  (Win98 currently.   It worked under Cygwin Vista 
too, but I've been away from my dual-boot Linux machines for a few 
months now and hadn't tried readline under '98).  Vista had an issue 
with the TERM needing to be set to cons25, but this box works ok 
with the default TERM=xterm setting and TERM=rxvt.   But as before, 
nothing beats   $ vi   and  >> do  :)

btiffin - what about PowerShell from MS? Haven't tried yet ...

well, just downloaded PowerShell and it boots 3 - 5 secs on my Core2 
Duo, 2 GB RAM :-) It can't run executables or I don't know how - 
it seems that it extends commands for Windows admins, dunno how to 
launch externall app from that :-)

Thanks BrianH.

Petr;  It was the MS "Genuine Vista" info grab for the free download 
that led me to Cygwin.  :)  I dutifully registered both my copies 
of Vista, and what?  MS doesn't remember?  <swearword> 'em.  I never 
tried PowerShell.  Once I discovered rxvt I quit searching.  Kinda 
like REBOL.  My progamming language quest is over.  Now the (language) 
interest is only cursory and even though I try and check out something 
new just about everyday ... nothing competes.  Go REBOL Go!

Googling, I just found out, that Cygwin allows also some other consoles. 
Poderosa allows tabs, that might be interesting running multiple 
sessions and switching between them ...

I can't wait until DevBase goes public. We could definitely use some 
help with these kind of bugs.

Brian;  Umm...Carl gave the nod to release the url for DevBase to 
the REBOL friendly a few days after it's initial rollout.  Has that 
changed?

BrianH - you should notice Carl privately about the need to accept 
latest submissions. Well, once done, do you think we are mostly ready 
for full R3 upload? I mean - all View and host C code?

Yeah. The security model doesn't scale right now. I have designed 
a new security model and am almost done implementing it.

The !DevBase group would be a better place for this discussion.

Same here, BrianT. It's nice to come home after a journey

there is the better solution ?

handl: func [event /local port] [  probe  event/type


port: event/port

switch event/type [

connect [  print  [ now port/spec/host  ]
           write port [ GET %/index.html ]  false]

read [ false ]


wrote [ false]


done [   print  [ port/spec/host  length? event/port/data ]  true]

close [ close port true]
error [ close port true]


] 

]




get-fast: func [hosts /local port ][



 foreach hst hosts [
  port: make port!  to-url join http:// hst 

  port/awake: :handl
  open port

wait 0.03
 ]


]

;example

urls: [
www.rebol.com
www.rebol.net
;"www.rebol.org"
www.apple.com
;"www.oracle.com"
;"www.google.com"

]
loop 10 [get-fast urls]

All;  I'm the volunteer for the new VID 3 documentation.  (And don't 
really feel that worthy, but that can't be an excuse to make it complete, 
concise and a nice read ... anyway ...)  It's only just in initial 
draft still (my bad), but it's all to save Gabriele and the rest 
of the core team time so they can get to the important bits.  


If you have anything that needs clarification, discoveries, how-to, 
complaints, well anything; please drop a note to this group, the 
btiffin user chat or please feel free to update the discussions page 
from http://rebol.net/wiki/VID_User_Guideand we'll try and keep 
some of the flotsam and jetsom noise out of Carl, Gabriele, Richard 
and Henrik's way while they finalize the REBOL 3 VID.   (And being 
a wiki, feel free to update the actual doc for that matter; keeping 
in mind that consistent style and tone is also one of the goals.).

Thanks and cheers.

btiffin, I would prioritize all the new stuff at first to get everyone 
up to speed.  I know that Carl use to supply us with a changes document 
to simply update us on the changes with a new release.  That might 
suffice better to get everyone up to speed faster.

Perhaps another page referenced in the Welcome section. VID3 is based 
on a different semantic model, so we shouldn't expect there to be 
a whole lot in common with VID2. It would probably be better to not 
confuse the VID3 docs with comparisons to VID2.

Brian, that is a huge bunch of work you have got in there already! 
 Will try and give a hand with the obvious things at least though 
I am less worthy than you by a good bit.

Has any Mac user tried to get the Alpha going yet, via parallels 
on an intel mac or darwine on a ppc mac?

btiffin, I was playing a bit with VID3 today and had trouble with 
Options. I think it would be good to have a listing of the Options 
available for each Style. 

In particular, I was trying to control the lenght of a field, alas 
without success.

Jean: mainly because things are not complete yet. in the end, options 
will be more consistant across styles (and they will look a bit more 
like CSS when it comes to look options).

in any case, the size of a field can be set by providing a second 
string. ideally, that would be the "mask" string (that tells what 
chars are allowed and so on), but it's currently only used as an 
example to determine the size.

for eg, if your field will hold a percentage, you could write:   
field "3%" "100%"     so that it will be appropriately sized so that 
"100%" would be visible in it without scrolling.

REBOL 3 works fine in VMWare Fusion on an intel mac.

it is also currently the only way for me run run rebol 2 :-)

Henrik, you mean rebol2/view right? Would it take much time for Carl 
to build an intel version for osx ?

I imagine he's quite busy right now.

but yes, I would love a version for OSX Leopard

and yes, I meant REBOL/View :-) Core runs fine.

nice alpha, any chance to get get some pre-information how to use/test 
 task!  ?   f-t: make task! [ ] [  print now/precise] ?

I did only some small test ... I posted some short console data, 
but can't remember where :-)

>> test: make task! [wait 10 print ["Does tasking work?" newline]]
== task!
>> do test
Begin Task
== task!
>> print "Doing something else in console..."
Doing something else in console...
>> Does tasking work?

End Task

>>

thx pekr,  will try this.

strange, wait - within the task will crash rebol

really? Above code worked back in October ...

yes, it works via console but not with vid

test: make task! [wait 10 print ["Does tasking work?" newline]]

 view [

    h2 "Task" 
    button "Start" 	[do test]
    button "Stop"  	[   ]
    button "Quit" 	[unview none]
]