World: r3wp
[!REBOL3-OLD1]
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| BrianH 25-May-2008 [5934] | Gabriele, I like the ideas behind your VID3 and think that with only minor cleanups would be a GUI to brag about. |
| Joe 29-May-2008 [5935x2] | Hi, I want to create functions where all variables are local without declaring them. What is the way to do this currently and in rebol 3 ? thanks |
I use this for html blocks that have layout information (tags, strings, ...) and bind them to a local value of the function creating the layout but I don't want to have to declare multiple variables | |
| BrianH 29-May-2008 [5937x2] | In general, you don't because it is a maintenance nightmare. Ladislav came up some functions to support this kind of thing, though they haven't been ported to R3. Do you mean all referenced variables or all assigned variables? How would you specify global variables that you want to access? Do you want variables set with set statements captured too? How about variables set in inner blocks, or parse rules? |
I'm a little confused as to what you want to do here - perhaps a code snippet would help demonstrate. | |
| Joe 29-May-2008 [5939x5] | all referenced variables. Other variables are passed as arguments |
blk: [ <html> <title> tag-title </title> ... tag-x tag-y ...] | |
inside the function you do bind/copy blk 'local-var | |
local-var is defined but the other ones, tag-title, tag-x, tag-y ... I don't want to have to define in /local local-var ... | |
the bind should probably give an error for variables that are not set | |
| BrianH 29-May-2008 [5944] | All referenced variables would include ones like 'for, 'if and 'and. It seems to me that you want an object, not function local variables. That would be much easier to do in R3 with the improvements to bind but you can do it in R2 as well. |
| Joe 29-May-2008 [5945] | what I am after is in using rebol as a PFL (pure functional language), in which all references are copies. I read something in the wiki about a new function keyword which allowed this but couldn't find it again in the wiki . Anybody knows this func2 keyword ? |
| BrianH 29-May-2008 [5946x3] | No such thing. You would have to rewrite most of the mezzanines and natives to make a practical pure functional REBOL, as almost everything causes side effects and aliases. Pure functional languages tend to only be efficient when compiled - when interpreted they are dirt slow. |
You can manually use REBOL as a pure functional language, but it will be much slower and have more overhead. | |
On the other hand, there should be nothing stopping you from making a pure functional dialect that compiled to imperative REBOL, and the result might be faster than all but the best hand-coded REBOL, once you get past the compiler overhead. If you can compile ahead of time that won't be much of a problem. | |
| Joe 29-May-2008 [5949] | thanks, I am looking for a practical solution that doesn't require much work. I've moved away from rebol but I have a lot of legacy code i'd like to evolve, if possible |
| BrianH 29-May-2008 [5950x2] | Well, code that is written with aliasing issues in mind tends to look pretty much like mostly pure functional code, and function result chaining gets rid of a lot of variables. We have been trying to make functional programming styles easier in R3 and some of that is getting backported to R2 starting with 2.7.6. |
Many of the series functions are modifying though, and reassignment is used a lot. | |
| Joe 30-May-2008 [5952] | is there any doc on the functional programming styles in rebol ? thanks |
| PeterWood 31-May-2008 [5953] | It's 20 days since that last update to Docbase; is that a good sign or bad? |
| Henrik 31-May-2008 [5954] | not much to write right now |
| Kaj 31-May-2008 [5955x2] | Plenty going on |
New Core elements to support VID, and REBOL/Services being ported to R3 | |
| btiffin 31-May-2008 [5957] | Peter; It's bad in a non-bad kinda way. REBOL 2 seems to be keeping quite a few rebols in pay checks. That's good for coders but bad for ongoing public buzz. Buzzing about a loved hobby is completely different than buzzing about (still loved) work. Gabriele did me a huge favour getting the REBOL in mediawiki extension plugged in and it sits waiting. There is still work to get DocBase REBOLized, even if there is a slow down in the "fast pace, visible" R3 developments. DocBase is really for us, the community, so it goes in spurts. Next step (6 months later) is to make it so posting up MakeDoc is simple and easy, keeping in the REBOL headspace, including the document markup. |
| btiffin 4-Jun-2008 [5958] | Ok, it's a joke we'll prove wrong. What bet can't be won? The alpha bet. |
| Pekr 6-Jun-2008 [5959] | Gabriele today posted, that basic rebservices client is working with R3, being able to connect to DevBase. I think it is a good milestone .... |
| Graham 6-Jun-2008 [5960] | I see Carl has now rewritten VID for R3 |
| Karim 9-Jun-2008 [5961] | Hello. I want to start working on upgrading some code from R2 to R3. The only public alpha release is still far the beta release because some basic features changes or are not implemented. The last alpha releases seems much more interresting for studying R2 - R3 migration. Somebody knows when another public version will be released ? |
| Pekr 9-Jun-2008 [5962] | Hello Karim - we can't say yet. But - what is your main area of usage? Core features? or GUI? |
| Karim 9-Jun-2008 [5963x2] | In fact both. I worked on a multi-user contact management application that connects to a SQL database (mysql and sql-server). There are some main areas I want to investigate into : DB access (Trebase could be a sexy alternative to other db engine), GUI and business logic processing. In the last area, I think that rewrite some code in R3 can produce more elegant and more efficient program. I'm one of the guy who used hash! datatype ;-) |
OK I also have to admit that I cannot wait to play with a beta release. | |
| Pekr 9-Jun-2008 [5965x2] | Karim, then I think it is a bit preliminary to consider porting: - mysql, postgress - while those schemes are built upon raw TCP R2 stack as a schemes, someone would have to port them to async R3 networking kernel - sqlite - requires mostly DLL access. There is no DLL access in R3 and maybe there will not be one like we know it in R2. Carl is not decided yet, if we go via DLL layer like in R2, or via standardised plug-in interface, which is not ready though, as it needs modules, which are not ready either - GUI - Gabriele was working on new VID. It is now called VID 3.3 (third prototype). It is still not complete. But - Carl is trying to follow slightly different obectives, so he decided to rewrite it and bring us VID 3.4 prototype (probably called GIDI) - View, unless Cyphre fixes some harsh bugs in its kernel, is pretty much buggy and makes VID3.3 crash in few secs to minutes. |
That is the reality. I will try to talk to Carl, so maybe we will be able to plan on next release and define featureset, which gets completed and released. | |
| Karim 9-Jun-2008 [5967] | OK. Thank you for the informations. I think the release notes of next public version needs to define what can change and what's will remain quite the same until the beta or final release. Then it will be easier tu us to know on what we can focus. |
| BrianH 9-Jun-2008 [5968] | Assume that much of it can change, though most of what has been backported to R2.7.6 is not likely to change much. |
| Graham 9-Jun-2008 [5969] | Karim .. do you have some screenshots or a demo of your CRM? |
| Pekr 25-Jun-2008 [5970] | Does anyone know anything internal about R3 development? I am really disappointed, we are down to 0 - 2 persons on r3-alpha channel per day. That is really disappointing ... |
| btiffin 25-Jun-2008 [5971] | I noticed that too. Creepy quiet. I don't think it's disappointing (yet) ... feels more like a calm before the storm. |
| Henrik 25-Jun-2008 [5972x2] | can't chat and code at the same time, I think. ;-) |
hey, there's even a comment on the wildfire blog entry from Carl that says: "Sorry that I do not have time to do more -- too busy with work (REBOL Tech)." | |
| Pekr 25-Jun-2008 [5974] | In the meantime I re-read port documentation, and try to study http scheme, but this is hardly usefull for the community, as I am not the one able to bring in e.g. ftp or other scheme anyway :-) |
| Henrik 25-Jun-2008 [5975] | suits me well. won't have time for R3 work until July anyway. :-) |
| btiffin 25-Jun-2008 [5976] | I have 75% of a dict:// scheme written. (First thing I did when I got in on the alpha. Took about 6 hours. Then I got confused on the new I/O completion rules. Haven't looked at it since.) Soon. I use the R2 dict-demo all the time now. Nothing beats using the REBOL console as a dictionary/thesaurus. From using KDE, there are all kinds of schemes on the wishlist. |
| Graham 25-Jun-2008 [5977] | Well, Carl effectively killed Gabriele's VID3 by saying he was changing it ... and so we wait. |
| Pekr 25-Jun-2008 [5978] | The bad thing is, that while we could have more than one UI, Gabriele does not seem interested in finishing it, and noone apart him is probably technically skilled to finish it .... |
| Henrik 25-Jun-2008 [5979] | There's no point in finishing VID3 if VID3.4 functionality strongly overlaps, so we'll have to wait and see whether it does. If it does not, then VID3 can be finished as a separate project. |
| BrianH 25-Jun-2008 [5980] | That assumes that the technical ability (of which there is lots) and the programmer time (of which there is little) is available. |
| Henrik 25-Jun-2008 [5981] | not just that, it usually has to be the same person starting it and finishing it. that's why many open source projects fail. :-) |
| [unknown: 5] 25-Jun-2008 [5982] | What happened to Cyphre? I thouht he was involved in some of that stuff? He always had the coolest REBOL View apps. |
| Henrik 25-Jun-2008 [5983] | He's working on QTask. |
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