World: r3wp

Yes I have - I like it alot.

thanks very much

Your welcome.

I use it in about 50 different places. If I didn't have it, I probably 
wouldn't be working with REBOL today. It's that important to me.

I recall someone (don't recall who) made a REBOL gui that wasn't 
square but oval shaped and based solely on faces (no layout use).

Was very functional and fast.

Maxim has done something alternative, but I haven't used it, so I 
don't know if it was that.

This was so long ago I don't have a clue who it was.

in the mean time, it looks like VID for REBOL/View 2.7.7 might contain 
considerable additions, such as GUI resizing and proper error parsing 
of layouts.

Are we going to do a 2.7.7?

maybe sometime. we have DevBase and an AltME world for it, so people 
are submitting patches to it.

the good thing about it is that it shows that this same open development 
model intended for R3 actually works.

I can access the ALTME world for the r2-beta but didn't know there 
was another one for 2.7.7.   I didn't know there was a devbase for 
it at all.

It's the R2 beta world. Anton is quite active there. Devbase for 
R2 and R3 is the same place as well.

Ok, I seen anton active lately in R2-beta but overall it has been 
a bit dead.  I think to livin it back up we need some clear stradegies 
laid down like we did before the last update - that one went very 
fast.

I believe DevBase is closed group for now.

or maybe I'm being kept out - lol

The only problem is that Carl needs to do all the approvals of the 
patches, which is not likely to happen soon.

Devbase is read-only for everyone, but writeable for a selected few.

yeah plus he announced that other secret project

I wonder if the secret project is part of "wildman" he discussed 
before.

Wildman is a "secret project" that examines the question: what is 
the minimal environment for running REBOL? Can REBOL operate natively 
on specific hardware, and if it did, what components would be necessary 
to be successful? This project will begin early spring. Complete 
development will depend on our results and possibilities for potential 
funding.

Sounds like REBOL Embedded solution is in the works to me.

yes, it could be. it's a very exciting project.

it would also make sense to do that now to avoid any design errors 
that would make it harder to run on embedded hardware later on.

yeah I have to think that Carl is thinking portable here maybe phones 
and tablet style systems.

I think I recall Carl saying at one time that he was into PIC controllers 
or something which would lend some possibility that Wildman was an 
embedded type thing.

I expect no Wildman. Wildman would be C level. But Carl said it is 
REBOL code level, no?

So, my expectation is that he either refers to VID3.4 (but the info 
about 3.4 was already public at that time), or Reichart needs something 
for Qtask :-) Well, it could be some /Core stuff like threads for 
e.g. (but those need modules). So maybe protocol stuff? We also know, 
that in order for DevBase to be released, Rebservices are needed.

But - if Rebservices don't change its design, they are dead anyway 
- hardly useable ...

Petr; ??  what design change would you make to LNS?

Pekr,  I think you are just comparing it too much with Rugby.

Conceptually I think it's pretty solid.  The implementation may need 
a dusting over, but it has not even been advertised as ready for 
prime time yet.  All good things ...

Henrik - it will change - its upper (user) layer is hardly acceptable 
for me....

Commands being just a parse code is plain wrong.

When Carl asked me about VID3, I posted my objectives to the VID 
group, and to him. Few days later I needed to study, if Rebservices 
would be good for our kiosk advert system. It could be, but I refuse 
to work with it, if it does not change. It is difficult to use, the 
layering has to change. And Carl agreed to some extent. Expect some 
changes to it in the summer months.

<aside and joking>

Anyone that is getting tired of waiting for R3.  Do what I did; get 
out of the computing field for 5 or 6 years, do some manual labour. 
 And then on return, regret missing out on all the nifty developments 
and racing to play catch up.
</joking aside>

P.S.  I do regret not following REBOL development from the day shortly 
after Graham made his (to me) famous 2nd millennium post to comp.lang.forth 
till some 18 months ago.  I always feel just that little bit left 
out as I learn things that many of my REBOL heroes have grown, to 
what I see as, "been there, done that".  I want to get there and 
do that too!

Petr; Yes I agree.  The end-user interface to services needs a good 
duffing.

And, just so you know.  I envy you, your history with REBOL - watching 
all the incremental changes and involvement in this; one of computing's 
greatest experiments.

I don't bother about not having Rebol3 complete. It is an amateur 
project (read this: done in the spare time). The timeline I have 
posted into the ML last year seems the correct one. VID for the end 
of 2008 / start 2009 and the other things complete for the end of 
the year 2009.

2010 is the completition date for REBOL3

Oooh, I'll disagree on the "amateur" comment...completely.  A small 
team of  people it may be, amateur it is not.  Even I've been paid 
for REBOL work and I still count myself a clown.

There is nothing in this world stopping anyone from becoming a full-time 
rebol.  If not as an employee, as an entrepreneur.  Nothing.

I have used "amateur" to reflect the time that the development group 
actually seems to have available for developing REBOL3 and not its 
quality.

I'll still disagree; 

Some of "our" lot in this whole endeavour may be deemed non-expert 
but REBOL itself is developed by some highly skilled professionals. 
 When R3 finally does hit beta (or even getting past the next few 
alpha hurdles), I think our current lower than normal morale will 
bounce right back to the heights of euphoria.


No soup for you!   :)   (But keep up the good works on DocBase - 
it may not always seem like it, but your efforts are appreciated 
Giuseppe).

I totally agree with you about the "high quality skilled professional" 
but do you agree about the fact that to not be a amat.... (no, lets 
change the word you don't like) "Part Time project" the development 
team must work 8/12h over 24 and 5/6 days a week exclusively on REBOL 
?

However, I admit I have used a difficult word that could hurt and 
upset someone... hei but is discussion made only of gentle words 
? No ! Sometime we need salt and pepper !!

Yes I do agree, and I also think that IS the case.  The core developers 
are full-timers.  It is just that the core team is very small.  And 
even some of the helpful volunteers, BrianH, Nenad, Pekr, Ashley, 
Henrik, Gregg ... too name but a few, probably get less sleep than 
they deserve due to REBOL developments.  Efforts we get to benefit 
from.  No doubt you yourself felt a little sleep deprived when you 
did the massive R2 document push to the wiki.  :)

I would like to feel Sleep Deprived again soon but Rebol Documentation 
Project I want to mirror isn't going back online anytime soon :-(

I like the way you discuss things GiuseppeC - your thoughts are very 
well selected.