World: r3wp

I agree, which makes it essential that VID3.4 is good enough. Perhaps 
it would help pushing Carl to make VID3.4 as complete as possible, 
so we won't need VID3.

there are usually only alternatives to something if the things already 
in place are inadequate.

Well, I don't see how Carl will have time to write all the widgets

So, I guess we all have to pitch in as soon as the prototype appears

He doesn't have to write the widgets. He only has to build an engine 
that will let you write most widgets with ease.

Yes, that was what I was meaning.

For example in VID it's very hard to build a well-functioning popup 
menu due to some restrictions on panels, clipping your content and 
you can't put things outside the window. in VID3.4 it should be simple 
to make a popup.

We need access to all the information that we can get to place those 
popups in the most appropriate area

we need to be able to replace Rebol native fields with OS type fields 
too eg. handwriting recognition

I had proposed a system to abstract input from the GUI a while ago, 
but it was mostly ignored. it's probably not that easy to implement.

Suggesting the impossible?  Or improbable ?

I don't know :-)

but what it would do, would be to let you use very different devices 
for regular input, such as a Wii controller. there would be no changes 
to the UI itself. if you need additional graphical controls like 
an on screen keyboard, it would be part of the abstraction rather 
than a part of your GUI.

then you make an input model, which maps controller behavior to what 
you want to get out, and then you could use it for regular input. 
this would work the same for input devices that some handicapped 
people use.

Have you done some work on this ?

only theoretical.

Or, is it just a gleam in your eye?

it's just an idea

but I think it makes sense. I've studied the problem a bit. Everyone 
else makes special cases out of it, rather than a generic system 
for strange input devices. I had hoped that VID3 could be the first 
GUI ever to do this. It would mean that you can write a GUI and a 
handicapped person or a person using handwriting recognition would 
be able to use it without modifications.

There was the Tao which scaled output to fit the devices available.

So, the reverse?

It was prompted by using the speech recognition system in MacOSX. 
While it's fun to use, it only lets you speak certain commands and 
only within the currently active window. There's no real system there, 
but if there was, it would be awesome.

Yes, this is input. the output is not relevant to the input in that 
sense. There are usually certain combinations, but they should not 
be depending on eachother.

we should aim for this

input systems are changing all the time .. we should just write the 
HAL just once

how does the hand writing system work in tablet windows?

do you write directly in the field and then it's translated to normal 
chars?

you just write in a text box

yes

no need for special gestures

ok, it's different from PocketPC or Palm, then. At least the version 
I used had a separate text box for input.

it tracks the strokes in time so it knows what the characters are 
likely to be

Why would Gabriele finish it for ?

 You know, I need it for my apps too. :) But hopefully Carl's version 
 is good enough.

It really seems noone (not even Gabriele?) knows what's Carl currently 
cooking? :-) Let's hope we get some things to test soon ....

I don't think we'll be seeing anything very soon. From observation, 
in the past Carl has been active in DocBase before new releases.

He hasn't updated DocBase for over a month.


I think we can only start looking forward to a new release  after 
Carl has started to update DocBase again..

that might not be accurate measurement of Development. DevBase was 
actively update also by community. But when Carl works on something, 
and only he knows about some area of development, noone can update 
it. I assume first alpha of VID3.4 (GIDI) in August at max. I think 
that whatever system you come-up with, the basic idea can't take 
longer than few weeks. And few weeks ago I got info that Carl had 
already some parts running ...

how was Gabriele's vid 3 not jiving with Carl's vision?

Only Carl can say for sure.

Carl have true sight or double sight ?

I think he thought it was too complicated.

Yes - internally complicated, strangely layered, not easy for average 
programmer to extend/add new stuff, maybe a lack of good docs, maybe 
a mixture of everything mentioned.

Gabriele - will you finish it anyway, or will you first wait, what 
Carl comes up with first?

Carl mentioned that he liked the dialect and didn't want to change 
what it would be capable of, but that was before the announcement 
of the new networking scheme, which apparently is somehow integrated 
with VID3.4. There is for example a SEND command in the new dialect, 
so I guess he wants to make it extremely simple to build networking 
code into a GUI. I just hope he does it right. :-)

networking integrated with Vid?

Guess we'll just have to wait

yup

the R3 alpha world appears dead

It would be good for Carl to communicate more what is happening

Nature abhors a vacuum

I mentioned to him that the communication is big problem in my opinion. 
Those silent periods do really a bad damage. I can't imagine any 
bigger company taking RT seriously. You either have private life 
and ranch, or you treat your company profesionally ...