World: r4wp

Brian: I'm aware of that. The probabilty of someone porting Red to 
old MSDOS (no Unicode, no multitasking, no native TCP/IP) is very 
close to zero. If someone does it anyway, we'll adjust our targets 
ID accordingly. In the meantime, I prefer typing "-t MSDOS" rather 
than "-t Windows-Console" on command-line. Also, it's easier to remember 
for everyone, after all it's just an ID, nothing else.


If you are thinking about FreeDOS, which is probably a more likely 
target than real old MSDOS, I guess we won't have any name collision 
then. ;-)

Call it DOS. But the MSDOS target name still annoys me. I don't want 
a legitimate, common target build to bring back such bad memories 
:(

Actually, not all of the memories were bad. In recent years I was 
thinking of making sure R3 would run on a set of libraries that enables 
Windows apps on DOS, but at the moment I'm having trouble finding 
the link/name of those libraries.

Ah, here it is, the HX DOS extender: http://www.japheth.de/HX.html

what about calling it CMD (as is the command, cmd.exe, which you 
have to issue to open that black old console), or CON, as a "console"?

I've hesitated between DOS and MSDOS in the beginning, and I've chosen 
the later one, because it is more meaningful for everyone, especially 
those that do not use Windows often (or never use it). As I've said, 
if someone ever ports Red to old MSDOS, we'll deal with the name 
conflict then.

Pekr: Red is not a Windows-only product. ;-)

I meant call the real DOS target DOS. No Windows-based target should 
have DOS or MSDOS in its name :(

Brian: as I've explained to Kaj earlier, Windows does make a difference 
between apps built with GUI or built for console- only. If it wasn't 
the case, we would only have the "Windows" target.

I have no problem with the existence of the target, and will likely 
use it; I just don't like the name.

Congratulations on the release of Red Alpha.

Another OS for running Windows console binaries (and possibly more): 
http://www.jbox.dk/sanos/

I also thought about "WinCon" at the beginning (and "WinGUI" instead 
of "Windows"), but quickly dropped it because it would not be easy 
to remember, and inconsistent with the way other targets are named. 
See the targets list at the bottom of this page: 

https://github.com/dockimbel/Red

Calling it DOS would annoy me, as I had that on Atari 8-bit :-)

well, let's not loose much time upon what just annoys us re naming 
convention of not so important language parameter ... :-)

I don't want *that* target called DOS, I want it called something 
without "DOS" in the name, since it's not for DOS (MS or not).

http://bikeshed.org

Brian: you don't have to like it, on Windows, it's the default target, 
so you'll never have to type it as long as you're not cross-compiling 
from another OS. ;-)

Thanks Peter! Your early unit tests helped it get out without too 
many bugs. ;-)

That does help :)

Well I did find one bug :-)

Red Alpha release! Where's the party?

Kaj: thanks, I'm bookmarking this one, I will certainly need it in 
future. :-)

It's a cyber-party and it's happening here. ;-)

OK ;-) *PLOP* as we say here in the Netherlands

We're just lacking some ASCII-art beer to make it more fun!

Pekr: I think the Twitter widget I'm using on my Blogger's site is 
dead, not a single other Twitter plugin for Blogger is working...

well, I have twitter code on my 2zone site, ad it works ....

They changed their API a few weeks back

RED-system/GTK-bindings on Ubuntu 12.10 : all the samples compile 
but GTK-Widget give an error at run time :

red-system/builds$ ./GTK-widgets 


(GTK-widgets:2867): Gtk-CRITICAL **: IA__gtk_container_add: assertion 
`GTK_IS_WIDGET (widget)' failed

*** Runtime Error 9: float invalid operation
*** at: B64F5C20h

Run-All    v0.8.2
Quick-Test v0.9.1
REBOL       2.7.8.4.2
Red/System Test Suite

ok - logic.............................81 / 81
ok - byte..............................40 / 40
ok - c-string..........................20 / 20
ok - struct...........................116 / 116
ok - pointer...........................69 / 69
ok - cast..............................88 / 88
ok - alias.............................23 / 23
ok - length............................11 / 11
ok - null..............................11 / 11
ok - enum..............................19 / 19
ok - float.............................60 / 60
ok - float32...........................55 / 55
ok - lib...............................13 / 13
ok - get-pointer........................5 / 5
ok - float-pointer.....................61 / 61
ok - namespace........................109 / 109
ok - not...............................44 / 44
ok - size..............................37 / 37
ok - function...........................6 / 6
ok - case..............................64 / 64
ok - switch............................85 / 85
ok - exit...............................9 / 9
ok - return............................25 / 25
ok - modulo............................29 / 29
ok - math-mixed.......................114 / 114
ok - infix..............................2 / 2
ok - conditional.......................13 / 13
ok - common............................16 / 16
ok - byte-auto.......................3636 / 3636
ok - integer-auto....................2778 / 2778
ok - maths-auto......................1661 / 1661
ok - float-auto......................1617 / 1617
ok - float32-auto....................1023 / 1023
ok - alias-compile......................3 / 3
ok - cast-compile......................16 / 16
ok - comp-err...........................2 / 2
ok - exit-err...........................3 / 3
ok - int-literals-err...................1 / 1
ok - output.............................3 / 3
ok - return-err.........................5 / 5
ok - conditions-required-err...........23 / 23
ok - inference-err......................1 / 1
ok - callback-err.......................2 / 2
ok - infix-compile......................3 / 3
ok - not-compile........................1 / 1
ok - print..............................3 / 3
ok - enumerations compile..............12 / 12
ok - pointer-compile....................2 / 2
ok - namespace compiler tests...........5 / 5

ok - Red/System Test Suite..........12031 / 12031
       in 0:00:42.94891

Congratulations on the new release! It's hard to believe how fast 
things are moving these recently.

SDL Samples Ubuntu 12.10 SDL version: 1.2.15... all OK

Doc, are you thinking of doing anything in particular to make the 
lexer be easily accessed from a hosting environment? It would be 
nice to see Red supported in a deeper way by something like Sublime 
Text.

DanielN: thanks for testing, I will have a look at the GTK issue 
later today.

AdrianS: we can make the lexer part of the upcoming public API accessible 
when compiling Red script as shared library. If you have suggestions 
about how the lexer should be exposed in order to facilitate integration 
with code editors, let me know.

Kaj: I got a reply from AVIRA telling me that the binary I've submitted 
was clean:

https://analysis.avira.com/en/status?uniqueid=KwPWqW429CmT1fNpbHWQgDxQ8ryDHO4T&incidentid=1301128

WebKit ( I don't ckow if this can help... ) : GTK3 sample work fine 
for me after "/usr/lib$ sudo ln -s libwebkitgtk-1.0.so.0 libwebkit-1.0.so.2"... 
and sometimes  : ./LazySundayAfternoon-Browser 
java version ("1.6.0_24"

OpenJDK Runtime Environment (IcedTea6 1.11.5) (6b24-1.11.5-0ubuntu1~12.10.1)
OpenJDK Server VM (b1uild 20.0-b12, mixed mode)

*** Runtime Error 32: segmentation fault
*** at: A66DB327h

Daniel, thanks for testing. The GTK error is recent; I reported it 
last week or so. But I didn't get the float error with it, which 
makes me think I need to add back FPU initialisation to it

WebKit has been changing their API a lot, so the binding is only 
for the older version. Segfaults and such would be expected when 
fooling it. Also, the GTK binding is developed for GTK 2 at the moment. 
I'll update them when I start running newer versions myself

Anti-virus: should I suspect that we have to submit every build of 
every version of every program to all anti-virus vendors to get them 
recognised?

Only if Red does stuff that will trip the heuristics, or be run on 
a system with AVG (since they require you to pay them money to revert 
a false positive diagnosis). Which we can't know ahead of time because 
those heruistics are unpublished and thus untrustable.

Ah, another modern extortion scheme

Yeah. The way it goes with AVG is that any false positive dispute 
is automatically rejected, and escalation to dispute that requires 
paid support. I have refused to use AVG ever since they refused to 
retract their false positive diagnosis of R3 alpha 94.

Or rather an earlier alpha, the last private alpha build before we 
switched to public alphas.

It was a while ago, so pardon any mixups with the version.

Good tip. I'll use the same policy when advising Windows users

MS has a really great false positive dispute process. I've never 
had a problem with them. Even in cases where the diagnosis isn't 
false as much as it is iffy, such as diagnostic tools that admins 
need to use but which you don't want non-admins to use, it just labels 
tham as "Medium Risk" and lets you choose to allow them to run if 
you like on a case-by-case basis.

The new Windows Defenfer in Win8 is pretty much a relabeled Microsoft 
Security Essentials with a few more features. Haven't had a problem 
with MSE yet that wasn't resolvable.