FYI: Once was lost but now is found (Editor window in view)

Thanks..yes very nice. KeyKit uses something like that too. KeyKit is a superb MIDI processing environment complete with its own object-oriented language whcih is also used for the very clever KeyKit graphical user interface. Very good ideas there at many levels. Like ERBOL, powerful, deep, moutains of fun. http://nosuch.com/keykit/ I still miss the Amiga's screens! Anyone ever seen that anywhere else? KeyKit has a wonderful 'pages' metaphor which is sort like like a static version of it [no window shade dynamics]. It allows one to reduce visual [widget] clutter, but it also becomes a cool highlevel object handling interface. One can save and load the contents of any page much like REBOl handles files and ports. I recommend any REBOLERS really into REBOL/View or and thinking of extensions to play aroudn wiht KeyKit for couple of hours to see what I am talking about. Free, with source code, and executables for Win95/NT, Linux, and Macintosh. <OT: hotjkeygeekiness> It always seems like the good UI ideas in Windows are the lost and forgotten ones. Usually one stumbles across them when the cat decid to talk a stroll or I drop the phone or somethnig. My favorite [non-obscure ] top N win timessavers: 1. maximize all windows most of the time 2. WINDOWS/"START" + m = Mimimize ALL 3. ALT+TAB to get what you want or ALT+SHIFT+TAB if its a long list of open stuff 4. periodically when too many windows are open clean up again with WIN/START + m 5. WIN/START + e = opens up file explorer 6 TAB, backsapce and the 4 arrow keys do all the rest. adding SHIFT reverses the work flow The main reason I like this is it encourages 2-handed computing. I am not religous about it, but when doing heavy repetitive graphics work, way with 6 apps [dreamweaver, flash, ACDSee, Fireworks, UltraEdit, IE] plus folders for media content this really kicks in. </OT> ./Jason

Been to long since I have seen them, what are you refering to?

forgotten

And thank YOU! I was never aware that the Win/Start key was good for ANYTHING!

6

for

LOL! You & I could relate a lot I am sure! BUT I prefer CorelDRAW Suite. Enjoy!! Ammon

mmhmm.. Corel TRACE Utility in CorelDraw10 is a favorite. XaraX is a very nice tool which Corel had picked up but has gone indie again: http://www.xara.com/ [download their 30 day demo and check out the transparency tool!] ./Jason

Well each application could open its own 'screen' if wanted do. And also open little rectangular windows, but they were/are boring. Screens were fun because they were FULL screen graphic displays. No freaking borders where you did not need them - a better illusion of UI immersion, not just into the application but into the cyber-screen of the computer. Use the implied depth of the computer display. Instead of this !~#$# little rectangle boxes graphic clutter oppression we have now as standard. Depth: I always liked the way Amiga softened that line between computer and TV. Screens were the means. Depth was/is the goal. Moving depth.. Some programs used half-size screens as funky tool palettes. Most for the display output related to a graphics generation design screen of the same application. In the beginning, before anything else, adn for a long time after, when you multi-tasked a bunch of programs you could blow people's minds first by flipping though the open applications, using the Amiga equivalent of Windows' ALT+TAB. But the really hilarious thing, was that you could then grab the top of each screen and drag it down some or all of the way to reveal the running applications behind. Like it was a vertical descending garage door in a parking lot, sinking into the floor, a digital version of the famous Get-Smart title sequence. As you kept pulling down the successive screens you could discover all this wierd Amiga graphic stuff going on: Conway's game of life behind Fracgen behind DPaint behind RGS behind ... Teh effect was enhanced because the screens colors wre almost alwyas different. Often really garish, which people loved to complain about. but the cumulative effect was so much fun. Full screen flash running with full-screen REBOL/View offer a means to create a deeper immersive graphic UI simplicity. Using image viewers like ACDSee you can view lots of graphics files in continuous immersive slide show mode. So much better for review, concentration and presentation. A scrolling mouse [with wheel] lets you fly back and forth through the images, while keeping your minds+eyes on the art, not the UI. YES! ./Jason

Edward Tufte refered this mandatory border open_on_top_of and contained by a homogonized desktop as "Operating System Imperialism"

the screens could also be running at different resolutions

For what it's worth: if you are using Windows:.... If you minimise a VIEW LAYOUT window (e.g. click the "_" symbol at the topright of the window) its offset gets set to 3000x3000. It looks like RT were one variable short of a control structure, and decided to overload the OFFSET variable. It's a pain if you have a multi-layout design (eg a working window and a floating control panel). You can't just ACTIVATE or (re)-VIEW a layout if your user has minimised it. Colin.

Aha. Well that certainly cause the problem. Minimise the editor, then right click on the nt task bar and close the window without restoring it. Offset gets set to -31999x-31999 which was my problem. An annoying bug that needs squashing. Brett.

Suite.

I had heard that Corel got that, but didn't ever see anything so I just wondered... Enjoy!! Ammon